Welcome And What To Expect

Announcer 0:01

Welcome to the Leading Conversations Classic Podcast. We've searched through early episodes to find some of the best for you. If you've been with us from the beginning, you may have heard some of these. If you haven't, enjoy this classic episode. Welcome to the Leading Conversations Podcast, sponsored by the Excel Leadership Network. On each episode, JD Pearring will have conversations with church planting pastors and leaders from around the country. You can learn more about how to connect with Excel at the end of this podcast. Let's join JD now and listen in on this leading conversation.

Spring Valley Banter And Introductions

J.D. Pearring 0:45

Welcome to another edition of Leading Conversations with Excel Leadership Network. Today, all the way from Spring Valley, California, and you win a prize if you know where that is at this point. We have Brett and Karla Burner. Brett and Karla, thank you so much for being here. Thank you.

Speaker 4 1:03

Thanks for having us.

J.D. Pearring 1:04

So tell me where where is Spring Valley and what does that mean?

Brett Burner 1:09

Spring Valley is in East County, San Diego, which which kind of carries its own weight to say East County, San Diego. But we're kind of east of San Diego proper, the main city of San Diego. It's an unincorporated area. Spring Valley is an area of you know crossing the railroad tracks. We've got like Mount Helix, which is big and tall and beautiful, and we've got Casa de Oro, which is at the bottom of the hill, which is not.

Speaker 4 1:57

Or don't. Stay away.

Brett Burner 1:59

Or don't.

Speaker 4 1:59

Don't try to make our housing cost anywhere, please.

J.D. Pearring 2:03

So are you on the good side or the bad side of the trash? Yes. Okay. Good answer.

Growing Up Around Faith

J.D. Pearring 2:13

Well, hey, um let's just start from the beginning. Tell us uh each of you how you've grown up, just how you came to Christ.

Brett Burner 2:23

Yeah, um, it's kind of funny. My my mom, um I'm the youngest of three. Um, we're all a couple years apart. And um uh my neither of my parents grew up in the in the church. Um my dad had a Christian scientist background, um, but wasn't really a part of it. And um uh after I was born, uh early 70s, my mom watched Jesus Christ Superstar. And it it the gospel according to Satan, and um, but it left her with a lot of questions, and she started to explore her faith and what it meant, and she ended up in church. Uh, and my my older sister and I uh kind of went along with her. My my older brother was kind of in and out, and um, so I've just been in church since I was three years old. Uh, and I was in there and I was always in good Bible-believing churches, and I got doctrine and uh learned all the stories. When I hit uh fourth grade, it all made sense. I got baptized, uh, and it's just kind of been a long, long, slow, easy, easy, a long, slow walk uh through my faith. And um uh but but yeah, I mean it's just I I've kind of been in it. I it's not like I have this like long tradition. My grandparents went to this church, it's not like that, but I've I've really had a good benefit of having a uh believing mom and uh and good churches to be a part of um since I was a little kid.

Carla Journey Through Pain And Love

Karla Burner 4:10

Um yeah, mine is very different. Uh my background is um my family uh immigrated here. So my mom was about 16 when they came. My family came um to the United States from Mexico. And um, so they were Catholic, and you know, air quotes, you know, and um not not uh good Catholics, I guess, by the by definition of what uh Catholic should be. Not practicing, not practicing at all. I was baptized Catholic as a baby, but I didn't really know anything about it. Um uh we ended up moving up to Orange County, um, my mom, my sister and I, and her boyfriend. And um, we all lived up in Orange County and uh in Irvine, so not just a stone's throw away from Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa, which was at that point really experiencing its huge growth after the Jesus Revolution. And so it was kind of like the popular thing to go and take your lawn chair and go uh sit your lawn chair outside of uh Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa and listen to Pastor Chuck on the lawn. That's how we did it. So that was my first introduction to church um as a kid was going to this place and sitting a lawn chair out and listening to this disembodied voice talking about Jesus. I didn't even know. In fact, uh funny story is Brett and I went to Calvary Chapel years later, and and Pastor Chuck comes walking out on the stage, and I'm like, he's here? I had no idea. I'd never seen that word because when we showed up, but it was very um, you know, occasional. And so um my knowledge of Jesus uh growing up was very, very simplified. There's Jesus, uh, God will who there's this God, there's the Catholic kind of tradition of, you know, God is gonna punish you if you're bad. And um I had a lot of questions. I had a lot of questions. And um I'm just that kind of a person that I I've always been just very inquisitive. And um I had one aunt, uh, Maithia Maggie, who um decided herself that she was gonna walk herself down to the Baptist church down the corner from my grandparents' house in San Diego. And when I was down visiting, she would walk, she would take me. And so we'd walk down to this, down to the Baptist church, and she got saved and or you know, just radically transformed her life. And um, so I started talking to her growing into now my junior high years, into my high school years. Um, but my life was very tumultuous at home. We had a lot of upheaval. There, my family, you know, you if you want to name the different types of abuse that I have witnessed and experienced in my family, it was all of them domestic, you know, uh verbal. Uh there was rejection. There I, you know, did not know my dad. Uh, so there was a lot of pain um stopped up in my life. And so I was really hurting. And um I I like to say that I was loved into the kingdom. Um my aunt ended up marrying a young seminary student who became the youth pastor of that Baptist church. And um, they would just invite me as a junior higher and a high schooler to come whenever I was in San Diego to come um to youth events. And it was just, I loved, even in high school especially, I loved hanging out with the Christians because they were always so happy. And my home was always filled with a lot of um, you know, chaos. And so I didn't believe, I wasn't a believer, but they just invited me in and so they just loved on me. So about 18 years old, um, I was sponsored. Uh someone anonymously sent me on my first missions trip. Uh, we worked at um gosh, who's that guy? Tony Campolo, yeah. Tony Campolo runs a like inner where he ran at the time the inner city ministry. I don't know what happened to Tony Campolo, but he ran inner city ministry in like Jersey. We worked in the projects and God I had that was it. Jesus met me. I was like completely just bowled over with um with his love in that trip. And um, and so I came home different from that. And I loved that they they brought me and they invited me into um things that really now I now having been in ministry now for 30 years, sometimes we're like, you know, are you qualified, quote unquote, to come and serve and love? And and they just invited me into the family of God. And as a result, I just I I that's why I said I was loved into the kingdom. It was beautiful. And um, so from that moment, I was 18 years old, and I have I just haven't turned back. I fell in love. It was like I just fell in love with Jesus, and um, and then um my uncle, who is the youth pastor, invited me to come serve in a ministry. So now we're gonna move into probably your next question about how

Youth Camp Meeting And Early Ministry

Speaker 4 9:22

we met.

J.D. Pearring 9:22

And I was but I don't need to ask any questions, just go for it.

Speaker 4 9:27

Just get an interview. I'm just gonna run this interview here, but um but uh so he was now at that point he left the church, he was running a camp, uh like a Christian camp up in um the mountains here in the local mountains in Lake Arrowhead. And um, they had lived up there, he'd been doing ministry up there, and invited me to come serve as a camp counselor, like summer camp counselor. We slept in teepees, saying camp songs like the legit real deal for summer. And there was this guy there who just always talked about Jesus. He was really loud, played the guitar, drove a BW, and I married him. So he was he was my uncle's youth kid. So he grew up in my uncle's uh youth ministry in San Diego, but I grew up, you know, with my uncle, you know, but I didn't live in San Diego, so we didn't meet until then, and that was in 1992. I just graduated from high school, and uh yeah, so we got married a year later. We didn't waste any time.

J.D. Pearring 10:27

So you met at a youth camp. Yep, yep, camp counseling. And you were from Morris County, Carla, and Brett was from San Diego and you met at Lake Arrowhead.

Speaker 2 10:37

Correct.

J.D. Pearring 10:38

That's that's crazy. Yeah, what was the name of the camp? Do you remember?

Brett Burner 10:42

Yep, Alpine, Alpine Covenant Conference Center.

Speaker 4 10:45

Yeah, that's it. Uh-huh.

J.D. Pearring 10:46

Alpine Covenant Conference Center. Well, that's really, really uh really cool. Um two different directions, and you met, you fell in love, you got married. Where did uh the call to ministry come into play?

Brett Burner 11:02

I think it kind of started there, to be honest with you. Um, you know, for for me, um I I I was I've just always been once I once I made a decision, I was just out of high school. Um, I was 17, and I just I I I wanted to dig into my Bible. And I wanted to just, I'm like, I I want to know this, I want to learn this. And I just cracked it open and started reading. And um, and so I And you haven't stopped, have you? I haven't stopped. I haven't stopped since. Um, I I really began just kind of absorbing it, sucking it in. I wanted to know more classes, books, whatever I could get my hands on, sermons. Um, it just I I really have always wanted to just draw that into myself. And um uh so although, you know, transferring that knowledge into faith and life is is a whole different animal. So um, you know, I spent kind of 18 through 21 being really stupid. Um, never walked away from my faith, but just wasn't, you know, it wasn't making it from my head to my heart. Uh and um I believed it, I knew it, but I I wasn't living it. And then I finally kind of hit this point where I'm like, okay, now I'm now I'm on and I'm living it. Um, and so there at the camp, it was really um ministering to kids. It it was it was you know pouring my heart into other people. And I got I got to teach for the first time as a camp counselor, and I thought, boy, I could I could see doing this for the rest of my life in some way, shape, or form. So it really kind of transformed me in a way with that. Um, but then I got married. I wanted I loved business, I wanted to do things in that arena too. And so we uh I I wanted to get married, I had to get a job. Um, I that's where that was my my first job, was just my first job after I met Carla was working in a print shop, and that was literally the beginning of a 30-year printing career um that spanned printing and publishing and designing and editing and all of those things. So uh so I went a business route and never I never went to seminary, I never thought to go to Bible school, I went to business school. I I did those things all the while, you know, studying, growing, and and and learning and that kind of thing. So but shortly after we got married, we started teaching, um, we started working with the youth. And and like bang, I'm back into teaching, I'm back into um um working with the working with the kids, and that started me on a route of uh I was teaching um first service, but let me tell you something. Teach junior hires at 7:45 in the morning on Saturday. Um you better learn how to teach the Bible or you're done for. Um, that's that's probably one of the best lessons ever on how to that's your homiletics class right there. Homiletics by fire. Um and uh so uh so yeah, I've it it it was uh just that teaching and seeing kids getting it, once I figured once I kind of cracked the code on how to reach them, um it's it's been a life of teaching ever since.

Speaker 4 14:43

Yeah, I think I think uh you know, just to I know we're um the long answer to a short question, but um I think that that youth ministry experience when we first got married, I think that was within the first year of our marriage that we were doing that. And watching those light bulbs come on was for me, I'm a teacher. That's what I was went into teaching. I'm I was an elementary school teacher. And uh watching those light bulbs come on was so um man, I don't know, it was just very motivating because you wanted I wanted to see kids get to the point where I was at 18, right, as a teenager, um, and in high school, so confused and so many things going on in my life that um I felt the same as Brett. Like even though we were doing other things, he was working in business. I was teaching, um, I mean, we were at church, I think like five days a week with the kids and hanging out and doing stuff, Bible studies and youth group and just hanging out with the kids. I mean, if they weren't if we weren't at church, they were at our house.

J.D. Pearring 15:48

Yeah.

Speaker 4 15:48

And uh so yeah, that was where it started. So pretty much from the get-go.

Church Planting DNA And Hawaii Calling

J.D. Pearring 15:53

So you were doing the bivocational thing, working, that teaching, doing the uh the the business, the publishing business that you have, and then um just ministering, associate pastor, and stuff. When I met you, I think I first met you uh because a friend of ours in Hawaii said, uh, here's a couple that might want to go to Hawaii and plant a church. So I was I was a little wary of you guys when I first, yeah, uh huh. They want to go to Hawaii. Um but where did the church planting bug come, other than you wanted to, you know, shuffle off to Maui? What where did that come from?

Speaker 4 16:34

Um uh so funny enough, the way the Lord worked with us is um our very first church where we started serving was a church plant. Um we we had attended one of the larger churches here in San Diego, and um and that worship pastor was called to plant a church. And so we went, I think it was uh they had already started. His mom had started there from get the get-go, where they were meeting in a local park, you know, until they found a place. And it was about a year in, and we were at another church plant meeting at a rec center, and um and then we just it's just how the Lord placed us. He put us in church plant after church plant. So we served at that church plant for years, and then then that worship pastor left and planted a church in Tula Vista, so we went and with him and helped him plant that church, and then I mean we just yeah, we've just always been in church plants, yeah. Just it, you know, church plants that's just where God placed us in church plants. We weren't, you know, we and so we have had church in elementary schools, rec centers, uh, hotels, movie theaters. Yeah, uh, yeah, it's we've been butterwreckers like an old hamburger shop. I mean, yeah, so we've just been in church plans from the get-go.

J.D. Pearring 17:56

So and um where where did the Hawaii thing come?

Brett Burner 18:03

Um I didn't believe Hawaii existed until I could go there. Um, so uh I I had just always had this I I I love the tropical, I I love I love the tropics, right? Just personal. I love the whole concept of it. Um I was always dying to go there. And uh when we finally got to take our kids on a trip to Hawaii, um early early 2000s, yeah. Uh we were flying over Maui, and as we were flying over it, I thought to myself, this is I think I want to be here for the rest of my life. And we landed, playing, you know, we we we landed, did our did our vacation, went to church. Uh, I'm the kind of guy who like makes my family go to church on on vacations. Um and um uh but it's fun to do that, you know, it's fun to check places out. And um I I was like, man, I just I love this. I love the culture, I love the people, I love uh when we go places, we don't do the resorts, we like to go in the back streets and see how people are, see how people live. And and so I I knew that Hawaii was um uh that that there in fact what our mutual friend called the the the rainbow curtain, right? There's something behind all of it, and there's there is um drug addiction and um poverty and all of these things there. Um, and so I just that was where I wanted to minister. It's what I wanted to do, and um uh and I pursued that man. Gosh, 10 10 plus years.

J.D. Pearring 19:48

Uh we tried to kick that door open a number of times, but it never budged.

Brett Burner 19:54

It was even offered to me um uh a couple times. Uh in fact, in fact, even once even by you. And boy, that was the hardest thing to sit with uh uh you and this other pastor, and you're asking me, Do you want to take over this church? And like the yes was on my lips, yeah, you know what I mean? And and the Lord said, Hold on, he's not done yet. I mean, it was it was it was audible in my ear. Hold on, he's not done yet. And I had to let it go, um, and encourage him to keep and keep going, and he's still going, yeah. Um, which I'm really glad about, and um, so I don't I don't regret that. And um, but yeah, there was a point, it was so um hard for me. I wanted to be there so bad, I had to ask the Lord to just take it away. Um, and and maybe maybe someday it'll work, I don't know, but um uh and and I'm good with it now. But uh it was yeah, a place I really desperately wanted to minister.

J.D. Pearring 20:58

So this by the way, we we just uh in the last couple days have signed a church planting couple to go over to Hawaii and plant. Um, and we uh we signed somebody else a little year ago, and they're both um both of these couples are 10 plus years older than you. So there's still there's still a chance. Yes, I'm telling you there's a chance. But you ended up planting in San Diego

Planting Cedars Church In San Diego

J.D. Pearring 21:25

instead. Uh tell us about that experience.

Brett Burner 21:29

Yeah, um we were at a church uh after after another church plant. After we um after I finally let go of Hawaii and some of that church planting um vibe, uh it kind of hit a point where I had to let things go. Um my kids were about to go into junior high. I thought, all right, I've I've kind of been pushing this for a while. I need to take a break. I need to get my family. Your break. And so I pulled back. I just focused on work for a couple years. And we just kind of immersed ourselves in ministry at this new church. And after about two years, I had the opportunity to take on a uh a Bible study and start teaching it again. And so I did and I began teaching this Bible study weekly. And 20 people. Yeah, probably, yeah, probably about 20 people. And uh we taught it for about um about four, four and a half years. And I started saying to Carly, I said, you know, I I think it might be time. And then one time the the pastor was preaching, and he said, you know, maybe God's doing this, maybe God's doing that in your life, maybe he's calling you to plan a church. And I and I thought he just gave me permission. My my pastor just gave me permission to approach him to plan a church. And so I did. And um uh it was really cool. Uh he uh he knew I was a church planner at heart, but I promised him that I would only do it with his blessing, um, that I wouldn't plant a church down the street, I wouldn't take people, I wouldn't do these things. So he asked me, like he said, what's the plan? And I said, um, I said, I don't have one. He says, Well, who have you told? I said, You, I told you I would tell you. And he's like, That's awesome. And uh he says, So how do you want to do it? I said, You tell me. And I let him define the departure. I let him define how all of that was gonna play out. Um, I told him I would like to be able to tell the people in my Bible study, um, just so they don't find out in a weird way. I don't want to hurt their feelings. Uh, he asked me who I was gonna take. I said, I'm not asking anyone. Uh I said, if they come to me, I'll tell them what's happening, but I'm not asking anyone to come with me. Uh and um uh so that was that was very smooth. He and I still have a good relationship, I think, because of how we handled that. Um, about two months later, um uh I met with the people who told me that they wanted to come. And um they said, when are we gonna start? I said, I'm working on it. They said, How about next week? And so we just started having church. Uh and and and so that was that was kicking off the church plant. It's it's something I'd wanted to do and took that hiatus, and then it was it was it was really kind of time.

Leading Through COVID Division

J.D. Pearring 24:32

Well, I remember uh a lot of that. I remember that the church was going um really well, this new church, and then um something happened in 2020. What was um COVID? COVID hit. Carlo, talk about that because I know that was uh that was a little tough on you.

Speaker 4 24:51

That was rough, yeah. I think um uh we were coming to a really great place. Um the people were excited, our leadership team was excited. We had new faces coming on a Sunday morning, which was it's always great when people are finally just people who are unrelated coming in your door and um interested and and um checking it out. Our kids' ministry was growing. We just had our um our second women's retreat and it was amazing in uh what was that January, February of 2020? And then we hit COVID. Um so uh, you know, being in California, um it was a little stricter, I guess, than other places. Um and uh so we uh we tried to be as you know careful kind of what it was as for every anybody who's listening, anybody who knows how hard it was to navigate to make the right decisions there and and just pray and ask for grace from the the people of the church. And um and it was it was tough. And we had even within our leadership, we had some very strong opinions that were not the same of how things should go. And um, we were a very tight leadership team, very tight. Um, some of the people on our leadership team, and you know, upon further reflection, I don't know, there's a lot of things for uh to to um examine in that one, but we had known some of the people on our leadership team for over 20 years, some of them. And um, and some of them were dead set against how how uh Brett was choosing to do things or the leadership was choosing to do things. We had some that were just they were linked arms, they were ready to go. And um so for for me, I think the hardest part wasn't actually the the COVID, like the actual illness was, you know, we actually, I think because we were a smaller church plant, hardly anybody got sick within our church, but um, but what was so hard was the um were were the people who set themselves um kind of contrary to whatever it was we were trying to do. And it was on both ends, like both ends of the spectrum with how we were doing things. And it that was tough because um we didn't, we were trying to, you can't please everybody, but we're trying to honor God first, right, by what we felt called to do for the ministry and um and and to care for our people. So that was tough. And I think the hardest part for me personally was some of the people who took the hardest stand stance against us were some of our closest friends. And so that was my first time really experiencing was my first time being heard in ministry. People suck, you know. I mean, that's my take on it. We uh if we didn't suck, we wouldn't have needed a say a savior to die on the cross for us. But um, that was really painful, and um and some people who uh from our leadership team who chose to leave, that was really painful. And um I think I was dealing with the pain of that more than anything else. Like we were doing church, we did it out in tents for a while, you know, we kind of laughed about the thing. Yeah, it just it was what it was, but um that was really excruciating for me and very, very discouraging. Very discouraging for me personally. So yeah.

Church Merger Done With Humility

J.D. Pearring 28:39

I I remember uh well, I remember that time, and it was uh just to be graceful to some people, um, it was a really weird time, and people were scared to death and didn't know where who to get mad at. Um somehow it just seemed like hey, you can get mad at your local pastors, that's fine. That's the answer. But but I I was at a meeting where you guys were talking about this, and there was another couple there, David and Christina, and they were going through some stuff with their church, and your churches are pretty closed. And I just remember we had this meeting, we're praying for you guys, and there was just like um this thought of hey, why don't you guys connect together? And I remember coming up to you and saying, Um, have you thought about this? And I was probably the 15th person who told you that that day. Have you guys thought? You know, because it was it was just like well, hey, here's an answer right here. They need somebody, you guys need somebody. Uh, talk about how that went.

Brett Burner 29:45

Yeah, you know, uh uh I'd I'd known I'd known uh David for a while. Uh he was constantly hosting the events, the TM events, and uh that we were part of. And uh when we were struggling, what we the thing we were struggling with was once we finally kind of made it through COVID, everyone seemed so tired and so beat up that it felt that to start again would be to launch again. And and you you would just kind of mention that, and and people would just their shoulders would they would drop, like they'd lost their energy, and I didn't know how to get it back. And uh so I shared that at this meeting because we were we walked through and talk about the things that we're dealing with, and and um and David and Chris had just been sharing about the difficulties that they'd gone through very similarly, and so when it came to us and we shared specifically about that, uh they they came straight to us and and uh Chris leaned to David and said, you know, we have to go talk to them. And so they kind of grabbed us and spoke to us. And um he said, you know what, let's just meet together. Let's how about how about you you guys just take a break? It was the beginning of the year. Um, he says, we've got 21 days of prayer, it's four weeks, four Sundays. Um, I'll teach, you can teach, I'll teach, we'll do a group thing. Let's just invite your church out to take a break. Uh so I talked to my guys. Uh, we did that, and we got about two weeks into that. He taught, I taught, and David met with me and he says, He goes, I don't know about you, but I can tell you what I'm thinking. And uh I said, you know, I I think I'm thinking it too. And it was just it was a good mesh, the two churches coming together, and uh, so we kind of talked it through. Of course, you know, you get two pastors coming together. Um, someone's got to give, and someone's got to be willing to step back. Someone's you've got to be willing to lay something down. And um uh I felt the Lord calling me to say, look, step back, just be number two. Uh lift him up. He's gone through it too. You understand what it is to go through it, so be there for him. Um, and and Chris, lift up their hands and help them to do this ministry. Uh, and um, since I was, I have work, I've got a job, I was like, well, I can do that. And so I stepped back, I ended up teaching instead of every week, maybe about once a month, um, on average, maybe 30% of the time. And I um um and and then as I I don't know, as as a result, it was just a mesh. And as we slid into that church, um, it was very positive. The people accepted us very quickly. I I didn't have this feeling of I've had the feeling like you get a new pastor at your church, and you're like, who are you? You know, and uh why are you here? And what do you want? And I I never felt that. I didn't feel that one time. I I slid right in as Pastor Brett, like I'd been here all along, um, was very welcome. And so it it was a it was a very smooth, very clean uh merger uh of of the two entities. Very cool.

J.D. Pearring 33:30

Well, um how is it going today then?

Brett Burner 33:34

Yeah, so so um it's it's man, it's it's been such a radical two years because um we came in, we did that, it's it it was going really well, and then um we decided that we needed to uh we were gonna lose our place that we were meeting. So we got proactive and began looking for places to meet. And Pastor David found a church in El Cahon, also East County, uh, that also struggled during the pandemic, uh, that could use like they wanted to rent some space. So we uh uh had merged together in in January, February of 2022. And uh in September of that year, last year, uh we started meeting and sharing space with this with this other church, this Wesleyan church. And uh after about three months, we decided, hey, why don't we start uh sharing services together? We could all meet together and that'll be fun. And uh one thing one thing led to another. And in June of this year, um the the two churches, the the the the we merged into one church, and then one church merged into Oklahoma Wesley, and and so now we are uh uh a merged one ECW church, and uh uh and so we're now part of a uh of a of a larger entity at at the new location.

J.D. Pearring 35:08

It's a conglomeration. And that's a good thing, yeah.

Brett Burner 35:15

Yeah, it's a good thing. Um, you know, I from the time we planted Cedars Church. Um I've I've been I am very blessed to have been able to note I I've never seen planting in church out of another church go so smoothly. Um my relationship with that first pastor is still really strong. Um merging with one church went very smoothly. Not everyone came, but I gave people an out to not come if they didn't if they didn't want to come. I said, you don't have to come, but you have to go. You have to go out into the world, you've got to serve. Like you can't let let it, you can't just go do nothing. Um so not everyone came, but but that that merger was good and um and I think was strong, stronger because of it. And so now we've even this new merge. The people in the Wesleyan uh district have been saying, like, this is how it's done. This is how you do a merger. Um, it's not perfect, but we're growing through it and we're trying to make it work. So um uh, but there's not all this crazy contention that you see with a lot of mergers and things like that. Um so yeah, it's been really cool to see. It's it's it is a good thing.

Suffering In First Peter Plus Tips

J.D. Pearring 36:33

Well, I'm looking forward to the the next book you write on on that. Um on stuff. Hey, just real quick, I'm gonna ask you a leadership tip. But Brett, tell us about this book that you uh uh just published on suffering.

Brett Burner 36:50

Yeah, uh it's called Genuine Faith Making Sense Out of Suffering. Uh came out in July of this year, and it it started from a book series that I did, uh excuse me, a sermon series that I did pre-COVID. Uh, in fact, it's the last thing I taught before COVID. So, right before COVID, the 13 weeks before COVID hit the United States, I was teaching about suffering. And and that wasn't lost on me. Uh, and so as COVID hit, um, I kept leaning back into that teaching. So, as I'm teaching forward, I kept leaning back into that teaching and reminding everyone about how God uses suffering to make our faith genuine. He uses suffering in our lives to help us to grow, to mature us, to take us to the next step. That suffering is not only not a bad thing, it's actually a good thing. It has things about it that are uh imperative for our Christian walk. Uh, and so it's a journey through all of First Peter from beginning to end. Um people were starting to call it a commentary. I didn't even think of it as a commentary, I thought of it as a as a book on suffering, but uh, but it definitely covers all of the aspects of the book of First Peter.

J.D. Pearring 38:14

Although and you can get it on Amazon or wherever fine books are sold. Brett Berner's book, genuine faith. Hey, let's end with uh give us a leadership tip. Carla, you want to go first?

unknown 38:28

Sure.

Speaker 4 38:28

Um, you know, I would say um through, especially having walked through so many different uh transitions in the last few years, um, for me is protecting my love affair with Jesus personally. Um, I think that when we are so busy serving him and teaching about him and enacting programs, um that, you know, just like I want to protect my my relationship with my husband in our marriage in the midst of all the things that we're doing, I I have had to really um be very diligent in protecting my uh my intimacy with Christ and in the way that I do, which is for me, you know, intimacy with his word and and in that time because we can even get even being in ministry all the time um has had can can interrupt that and cause distraction in that. And so I think that that for me seems it seems very obvious and elementary, but we have met and talked to many pastors who honestly um ministry leaders who are not finding that in mid time themselves with Christ because they're so busy serving him, right? And um, so I would say protect that at all costs. That's my that's my tip.

Brett Burner 39:58

Yeah, for for me, um, you know, when when COVID hit, um, like I said, I just finished teaching through suffering. And I thought how perfect that God gave us this lesson uh to go into something that's hard because we've just taught about suffering. Um, and and yet what we saw when the pandemic hit was um I people forgot everything. They didn't just forget what they were just taught, they forgot about their faith, they forgot about love and grace and all of these things. Uh, I was like, man, it's time for revival. We've seen scary things happen before. The church, it's like it's gonna happen. I was preaching it, like it's time for revival. And instead, things just descended into chaos just in the church, not to mention the rest of the world. Um, we saw the real ugly side of of people. Uh, and so there's there's two things that um I that I would I would say the first is that when it comes to really hard situations, um, we have to protect what God is doing at the church level. Uh, and and it's not about ideology, uh, it's not about um the things that we want or how we feel, it's what is God doing immediately. And I think the hardest part of that is we lift up our ideol, our ideologies. In fact, uh here's my little trademark. Uh I call it ideolatry. Um we we we make we we make idols out of our out of our mindsets, out of our ideologies. And um uh and and what we can't do that, we and it so as a result, pastors need to make sure that they're drawing their people in to support what's happening there at the church level. Um, it didn't matter if uh you were more open or more closed or wearing masks or not wearing masks, and I don't mean from a health standpoint, I mean from a from a faith standpoint. There wasn't a right or wrong in the eyes of God, a biblical truth happening as far as how how certain things went. Um and and we made it that. We made our ideologies about about all of these things, we turned them into theologies in some way. And uh, and and so if more people were there to just support their pastor, even if they didn't agree with how they were handling a situation. Um, I mean, we asked the same of our wives or or our employees, look, I know you don't agree with where I'm going with this, but I need you to work with me. I need you to stay with me, and we need to have unity. Paul talked about unity as one of the most important things. He told the Philippians, gosh, just if you could just be unified, um, my joy would be complete. Like that's all I'm looking for. That's your last step. And and we lost that unity. So I would say leadership tip one is is is create that unity um within within the the body, no matter what. The other is um uh grace and humility uh at all costs. Too many of us just think that we we know it all, we've got it all, um, and we get harsh. And everything that we teach, uh everything that we share, um even calling out sin, we have to do it with grace, with gentleness, with humility, um, with compassion. Uh if if we lose that, we it's so easy to get caught up into our own ideologies. And it's not about me, it's never about me.

J.D. Pearring 44:00

So I appreciate that. And I think uh both of you exhibit that uh closeness with Jesus, the grace and humility and the desire for unity. So thanks for those tips. Thanks for telling your story. I think we could go on for another hour, but we need to get on with life. So thanks so much for being here with us. Have fun in Spring Valley.

Speaker 4 44:22

Yeah, thanks for having us.

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Announcer 44:26

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